Discussion archives for Paper 6
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 07:47:34 EST
From: Donald Rosenthal <ROSEN1@CLVM.CLARKSON.EDU>
Subject: Paper 6 - Short Questions
To: CHEMCONF Registrants
From: Donald Rosenthal
Re: SHORT QUESTIONS FOR PAPER 6
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
It is 8 AM EST (Eastern Standard Time - 1300 GMT) on Friday, February 20.
During the next 24 hours you may send SHORT QUESTIONS about Paper 6 -
"Students' Response to the Use of Computer-Mediated Communication (CMC)
for Teaching Chemistry"
by Rosamaria Fong
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DISCUSSION of Paper 6 will begin on Monday, February 23 and continue
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[ Part 4: "Included Message" ]
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 09:31:37 EST
From: Donald Rosenthal <ROSEN1@CLVM.CLARKSON.EDU>
Subject: Paper 6 DR: SQ about Pre-Entry Program and Study Guide
Some Short Questions for Paper 6
1. In you abstract you refer to the "pre-entry program"
What exactly is the pre-entry program?
2. Under Student Responses you indicate:
64% of the students accessed the study guide 2 to 3 times a week
68% of the students spent 2 to 3 hours working through the problems
a. Were these problems in the Study Guide or textbook?
b. How much total time did these students spend on the course?
3. a. Do better students tend to use the Study Guide more or less than
poorer students?
b. Are there topics on examinations which are covered in the Study
Guide but not in the textbook?
c. Are there topics on examinations covered in the textbook but not in
the Study Guide?
Donlad Rosenthal
Clarkson University
Potsdam NY
ROSEN1@CLVM.CLARKSON.EDU
[ Part 5: "Included Message" ]
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 13:35:14 -0500
From: George Long <grlong@GROVE.IUP.EDU>
Subject: Paper 6 GRl: SQ about server logs, time per page
Have you examined the server logs for students using the webpages ?? I
have found that students access the pages frequently, but stay generally a
very short time. So accessing a page may not be worth much. In general,
people's average time on a webpage is much less than a minute, and I have
found that students generally follow this. Also, it would be interesting
to see if students followed any particular path through the information.
-what topics gained attention, etc.
****************************************************************************
Dr. George R. Long grlong@grove.iup.edu http://www.iup.edu/~grlong/
Department of Chemistry
Indiana University of PA
Indiana PA, 15705
****************************************************************************
[ Part 6: "Included Message" ]
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 10:57:28 -0800
From: Walter Volland <wvolland@BCC.CTC.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paper 6 GRl: SQ about server logs, time per page
Many students simply down load a page and dump it to print if the site
is not interactive. The time on the page will be very short because
they are doing the work off line.
Walt
> Dr. Walt Volland
> Department of Chemistry
> Bellevue Community College
> Bellevue WA 98007
> 425-641-2467
> wvolland@bcc.ctc.edu
> http://www.scidiv.bcc.ctc.edu/wv/a101-140homepage.html
[ Part 7: "Included Message" ]
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 11:00:22 -0800
From: Walter Volland <wvolland@BCC.CTC.EDU>
Subject: Paper 6 -WV-: RE server logs, time per page
Many students simply down load a page and dump it to print if the site
is not interactive. The time on the page will be very short because
they are doing the work off line.
Walt
> Dr. Walt Volland
> Department of Chemistry
> Bellevue Community College
> Bellevue WA 98007
> 425-641-2467
> wvolland@bcc.ctc.edu
> http://www.scidiv.bcc.ctc.edu/wv/a101-140homepage.html
[ Part 8: "Included Message" ]
Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 14:37:22 -0500
From: George Long <grlong@GROVE.IUP.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paper 6 -WV-: RE server logs, time per page
But even interactive pages can be accessed for a very short time. I am
interested in the results for >this< "interactive" website (if available).
****************************************************************************
Dr. George R. Long grlong@grove.iup.edu http://www.iup.edu/~grlong/
Department of Chemistry
Indiana University of PA
Indiana PA, 15705
****************************************************************************
Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:28:42 -0500
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
Subject: Re: Paper 6 -RF - Answers to Short Questions
Answers to Don Rosenthal's questions:
1. In your abstract you refer to the "pre-entry program". What exactly is
the pre-entry program?
The Academic Studies Division at BCIT offers the Engineering Technology
Entry (ETE) program. This 15-week program is the pre-entry program that
provides academic upgrading to students who wish to enroll in
engineering-based technology programs at BCIT. The courses include:
- Chemistry (Grade 11 equivalent),
- Communication (Grade 12 equivalent) ,
- Mathematics, (Grade 12 equivalent)
- Physics (Grade 11 equivalent),
- computer literacy.
At present, the following technology programs at BCIT require Chemistry:
- Biomedical Engineering,
- Biotechnology,
- Chemical Sciences,
- Mining,
- Occupational Health and Safety,
- Petroleum,
- Plastics,
- Renewable Resources Forestry
- Renewable Resources Fish and Wildlife
- Wood Products Manufacturing
2. Under Student Responses you indicate:
64% of the students accessed the study guide 2 to 3 times a week
68% of the students spent 2 to 3 hours working through the problems.
(a) Were these problems in the Study Guide or textbook?
(b) How much total time did these students spend on the course?
At the end of each offering of CHEM 0010, students were asked to fill in an
evaluation of the Web-based study guide. The evaluation was to find out
whether students found the study guide useful, accessible, and easy to use.
(a) The evaluation comes back with 68% of the students using the study guide
2 to 3 hours a week working through the problems which are in the study guide.
(b) I do not know how much time these students spend on the course. It will
be interesting to ask them what the percentage of their studying on the
course was done using the study guide.
3. (a) Do better students tend to use the Study Guide more or less than
poorer students?
All of the students make use of the online assignments and interactive
problems in the Study Guide as an on-going assessment of their understanding
throughout the course. My impression is that the weaker students use the
Study Guide more extensively than the better students.
The Study Guide helps the weaker students to identify the areas in which
they have difficulties. Typically, every week a student goes through a cycle:
1. try the interactive problems in the current unit for practice,
2. go to read the unit pages in the Study Guide to make sure they understand
the concepts that are taught during lecture,
3. submit the online assignment for marks,
4. study the hints to previous online assignments to make sure the correct
choices were made for the right reasons and to figure out what went wrong
with the incorrect choices.
Each question in the online assignments directs the student back to the unit
and topic from which the question was taken. Going through this cycle helps
some students to develop their study habit.
(b) Are there topics on examinations which are covered in the Study Guide
but not in the textbook?
All the topics on examinations are covered in the Study Guide as well as in
the textbook.
Actually topic for topic, the textbook contains much more information than
the Study Guide. But what the Study Guide seems to be able to do is to
identify the learning outcomes and draw the student's attention to the key
points. On the surface, the study guide repeats a lot of what is said in
the lectures. But, by strategically hypertexting key words, students can
click to go deeper into the subject. It's the student's choice to pursue
the subject and not be overwhelmed with the pages of information in the
textbook. Maybe this is the interactivity about the Web that you can't get
with the textbook.
(c) Are there topics on examinations covered in the textbook but not in the
Study Guide?
The Study Guide is a subset of the textbook. All the topics on examinations
are from the Study Guide and, therefore, from the textbook as well.
Answer to George Long's question:
1. Have you examined the server logs for students using the web pages?
I look at the server logs every now and then to see how often students are
logging onto the study guide. Identifying the activities on the study guide
which belong to my students is not a problem because the student marks page
(which is password protected) is accessed very frequently. It's difficult
to conclude student's study habits just on server log information. Here is
an example of the server logging web activities in a recent 50-minute tutorial.
The tutorial took place in a computer lab. Each student had access to a
computer. Ten students came to the tutorial, and eight students logged on
the computers. Of the students who logged on, these were the logged
activities during the tutorial.
Student 1: 4 minutes reading unit content
3 minutes accessing course marks
Student 2: 2 minutes browsing the study guide
2 minutes accessing course marks
1 minute post assignment
Student 3: 16 minutes reading unit content
6 minutes on discussion board
17 minutes accessing the interactive problems
Student 4: 2 minutes reading unit content
1 minute accessing course marks
Student 5: 2 minutes accessing course marks
5 minutes post assignment
Student 6: 2 minutes accessing course marks
1 minute on discussion board
1 minute accessing the periodic table
Student 7: 13 minutes accessing unit content
13 minutes accessing the interactive problems
1 minute on discussion board
Student 8: 4 minutes accessing assignment
Although all the students stayed for the full duration, the server log
indicated a fair amount of inactivity. Since I was at the tutorial, I know
that everyone (including the 2 students who did not log on) was busy either
working on their labs, correcting their assignments, or working on their
assignments. From the server log alone, one could have only guessed at what
went on during the inactive periods. I find that log activities usually
gives the impression that students spend very little time on the site when
in fact they may be working on something that is course-related off-line.
Rosamaria Fong
British Columbia Institute of Technology
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
604-412-7438
[ Part 2: "Included Message" ]
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 07:59:11 EST
From: Donald Rosenthal <ROSEN1@CLVM.CLARKSON.EDU>
Subject: Paper 6 - Begin Discussion
To: CHEMCONF Registrants
From: Donald Rosenthal
ROSEN1@CLVM.CLARKSON.EDU
Re: BEGIN DISCUSSION OF PAPER 6
It is 8 AM EST (Eastern Standard Time - 1300 GMT) on Monday, February 23.
The next 96 hours will be devoted to discussion of Paper 6 -
"Students' Response to the Use of Computer-Mediated Communication (CMC)
for Teaching Chemistry"
by Rosamaria Fong
The paper can be retrieved from the Conference World Wide Web Site:
http://www.inform.umd.edu/EdRes/Topic/Chemistry/ChemConference/ChemConf98/
Messages should be sent to CHEMCONF@UMDD.UMD.EDU
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SCHEDULE
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February 23 to 26 - Discussion of Paper 6
February 27 to Mar. 5 - Short Questions and Discussion of Paper 7
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=======================================================================
[ Part 3: "Included Message" ]
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:12:24 -0500
From: Bert Ramsay <c3@BIZSERVE.COM>
Subject: Re: Paper 6 -RF - Answers to Short Questions
[The following text is in the "ISO-8859-1" character set]
[Your display is set for the "ISO-LATIN" character set]
[Some characters may be displayed incorrectly]
Don Rosenthal asks several questions (>>) about how the Study Guide is
used. I repeat a few, with responses (>)
>> 2. Under Student Responses you indicate:
>> 64% of the students accessed the study guide 2 to 3 times a week
>> 68% of the students spent 2 to 3 hours working through the problems.
>> (a) Were these problems in the Study Guide or textbook?
> >(b) How much total time did these students spend on the course?
> (a) The evaluation comes back with 68% of the students using the study
guide 2 to 3 hours a week working through the problems which are in the
study guide.
> (b) I do not know how much time these students spend on the course. It
will be interesting to ask them what the percentage of their studying on
the course was done using the study guide.
>> (b) Are there topics on examinations which are covered in the Study
Guide but not in the textbook?
> All the topics on examinations are covered in the Study Guide as well as
in the textbook.
My comment:
It would seem to me that the online use would increase as a % of total
time spent if the online practice problems were keyed specifically to the
textbook problems and/or exam questions, and if in the process they
received not just hints or "correct/incorrect answer" responses, but help
in identifying where they were having difficulties in their solution. While
most Study Guides have worked-out solutions to problems, these are of
limited use because a student gets a false sense of confidence that once
they see how the problem should be solved, they believe they will not
repeat the same mistake on the test.
I have developed the solution to this - and am presently exploring how
it could be incorporated into the web-based Study Guide.
Bert Ramsay, c3@BizServe.com
http://www.BizServe.com/c3
[ Part 4: "Included Message" ]
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 10:55:11 -0500
From: George Long <grlong@GROVE.IUP.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paper 6 -RF - Answers to Short Questions
>
>Student 1: 4 minutes reading unit content
> 3 minutes accessing course marks
>
>Student 2: 2 minutes browsing the study guide
> 2 minutes accessing course marks
> 1 minute post assignment
>
>Student 3: 16 minutes reading unit content
> 6 minutes on discussion board
> 17 minutes accessing the interactive problems
>
>Student 4: 2 minutes reading unit content
> 1 minute accessing course marks
>
>Student 5: 2 minutes accessing course marks
> 5 minutes post assignment
>
>Student 6: 2 minutes accessing course marks
> 1 minute on discussion board
> 1 minute accessing the periodic table
>
>Student 7: 13 minutes accessing unit content
> 13 minutes accessing the interactive problems
> 1 minute on discussion board
>
>Student 8: 4 minutes accessing assignment
>
>Although all the students stayed for the full duration, the server log
>indicated a fair amount of inactivity. Since I was at the tutorial, I know
>that everyone (including the 2 students who did not log on) was busy either
>working on their labs, correcting their assignments, or working on their
>assignments. From the server log alone, one could have only guessed at what
>went on during the inactive periods. I find that log activities usually
>gives the impression that students spend very little time on the site when
>in fact they may be working on something that is course-related off-line.
>
The question has to do with using the number of times the study guide is
accessed as an indicator of anything. Here we have 8 accesses, and 8 very
different uses, But in the data you present, this would count as 8
accesses - all the same.
This is important when you consider how much time and effort go into
creating such a study guide. I, for one, want to be sure that the students
are using what we create. although, I'd guess some students use the paper
study guides, and even their text book very little. I wonder what the
results would be if we could minitor textbook use as closely.
****************************************************************************
Dr. George R. Long grlong@grove.iup.edu http://www.iup.edu/~grlong/
Department of Chemistry
Indiana University of PA
Indiana PA, 15705
****************************************************************************
[ Part 5: "Included Message" ]
Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:28:46 -0500
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
Subject: Paper 6 - RF- Number of access
George Long wrote:
>The question has to do with using the number of times the study guide is
>accessed as an indicator of anything. Here we have 8 accesses, and 8 very
>different uses, But in the data you present, this would count as 8
>accesses - all the same.
>
>This is important when you consider how much time and effort go into
>creating such a study guide. I, for one, want to be sure that the students
>are using what we create. although, I'd guess some students use the paper
>study guides, and even their text book very little. I wonder what the
>results would be if we could minitor textbook use as closely.
I usually put in a counter in the opening page of a web site just to keep
track of the number of access to the site. Right now, I have 11 students
taking my course. The study guide counter indicates a counter of 279 hits.
This is the beginnining of the 8th week of a 15 week program. Roughly, this
equates 3 hits/week/student.
Rosamaria Fong
British Columbia Institute of Technology
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
604-412-7438
[ Part 2: "Included Message" ]
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:51:30 EST
From: Donald Rosenthal <ROSEN1@CLVM.CLARKSON.EDU>
Subject: Paper 6 - DR: Amount of Time Spent On-Line
Rosamaria:
While I have not had an opportunity to examine your Study Guide extensively,
I do like it and can understand why your students have indicated they found
it very helpful, easy to use and easy to navigate.
I have another question:
RE: TIME SPENT DURING EACH ON-LINE SESSION
In your paper you indicate:
> 64 % of the students accessed the study guide 2 to 3 times a week
> 68 % of the students spent 2 to 3 hours working through the problems
The above data suggest that they spend about an hour each time they sign on.
Your summary of the server logs for the 8 students indicate they spent a
total of 7, 5, 39, 3, 7, 4, 27 and 4 minutes signed on (?).
Are the server data consistent with the one hour per session conclusion?
Perhaps I don't understand what information the server log is providing.
Donald Rosenthal
Clarkson University
ROSEN1@CLVM.CLARKSON.EDU
Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 13:27:58 -0800
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
Subject: Paper 6 - RF Re: Amount of Time Spent On-Line
Don Rosenthal wrote:
>In your paper you indicate:
>
>> 64 % of the students accessed the study guide 2 to 3 times a week
>> 68 % of the students spent 2 to 3 hours working through the problems
>The above data suggest that they spend about an hour each time they sign on.
>
>Your summary of the server logs for the 8 students indicate they spent a
>total of 7, 5, 39, 3, 7, 4, 27 and 4 minutes signed on (?).
>
>Are the server data consistent with the one hour per session conclusion?
>Perhaps I don't understand what information the server log is providing.
The server logs the activity of the web pages. If a student ask the server
to display a web page, the server
log will indicate the time at which the page was accessed and the bytes of
information transferred. The server does not log the time that the user
leaves the page.
The student survey indicates that 64% of the students access the study guide
2 to 3 times a week. This could be for retrieving their course standing,
turning in their assignments online, doing the interactive problems, or
reading course material on the study guide.
68% of the students spend 2-3 hours working on the problems. I am quite
pleased with this response. But this is not something that I could have
extrapolated from server log itself. For example, a student may download a
page of the problems and do them offline. My server log would indicate that
a page of the problem has been accessed at a particular time and 'x' bytes
of information was transferred. While that student may take 2 hours to work
through that page off-line, my server log would indicate that a student
accessed the page for only 1 minute (or less).
I could put a counter on every page of the study guide to keep track of the
number of access to each page in the study guide. Or, I could extract the
number of access to each page from the server log. But the important
information that I will be missing is what happens during the inactivity
periods. Are the students still working on the problems, or have they
logged off?
British Columbia Institute of Technology
Chemistry department
Tel: (604)412-7438
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
[ Part 2: "Included Message" ]
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 00:09:41 -0500
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
Subject: Paper 6 - RF- Number of access
Some questions came to me privately and I thought I would post it to the
conference to initiate some discussions. Does anyone have any similar
experience with introducing other tools in their courses that were well
received by students?
>Do you have any comparisons of similar sections using the study guides
>and just traditional methods? Do you know if both groups would spend
>the same amount of time on average studying?
>From my experience in teaching CHEM 0010 before the use of the study guide
and after using the study guide, my students are spending much more on time
studying Chemistry. My guess would be that students are spending 2-3 hours
a week more on Chemistry because they are more focused on the subjects when
they use the study guide. My impression with my students is that with the
entire course presented to them right from the start, it gives them a sense
of comfort and confidence that if they work at it, they will do well ... so
they end up working at it more.
>Are there any studies that show that students learn more efficiently
>using the study guides? That is do students who spend 4 hours
>studying gas laws ( I should be so lucky) using the study guides learn
>more, better test scores for instance, than those who spend 4 hours
>studying using just traditional methods?
There isn't any studies done to show that students learn more efficiently
this way. I know that since I've been using the study guide in my course, my
students are getting better marks. They show more enthusiasm towards the
subject. My experience from the last two years is that the borderline
students benefit more than the better students. Somehow the Web medium
attracts these students to come back to try to figure things out.
One of the reasons that I wanted to try out the Web medium is because the
Internet is available 24 hours a day. From that aspect alone, it makes me
more available to my students. It's proven to be more efficient for me in
that respect. If I can give each student one-on-one time help in their
studies, I know they can do better on tests and learn more. I guess that's
why some students retain private tutors. A web-based study guide is the
next best thing to that one-on-one. Does anybody have any similar experience?
>I'm wondering on the basis of some of my own work if something new
>attracts students and they spend more time, which is great, but it
>doesn't tell us if the new method used is more efficient. Something
>that is only going to be new for awhile is not worth as much development
>time as something which is actually more efficient and new. ...
I agree with you. But I don't see the Web going away.
Rosamaria Fong
British Columbia Institute of Technology
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
604-412-7438
[ Part 4: "Included Message" ]
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 09:42:25 +0000
From: George Long <grlong@GROVE.IUP.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paper 6 - RF- Number of access
>One of the reasons that I wanted to try out the Web medium is because the
>Internet is available 24 hours a day. From that aspect alone, it makes me
>more available to my students. It's proven to be more efficient for me in
>that respect. If I can give each student one-on-one time help in their
>studies, I know they can do better on tests and learn more. I guess that's
>why some students retain private tutors. A web-based study guide is the
>next best thing to that one-on-one. Does anybody have any similar
experience?
>
This is a wonderful and intriguing statement. The assumption here is that
we put something of ourselves into the webpages, and that in this way,
webpages, with their interactivity, differ from handing out a paper study
guide. The whole problem is just crying out for some good AI. I guess
thats why I'm interested in exactly how the students use the web study
guide, what paths they take through the information, etc. Understanding
this should help to create more efficient study guides.
****************************************************************************
Dr. George R. Long grlong@grove.iup.edu http://www.iup.edu/~grlong/
Department of Chemistry
Indiana University of PA
Indiana PA, 15705
****************************************************************************
[ Part 5: "Included Message" ]
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 11:11:35 EST
From: Walt Volland <Luckybel@AOL.COM>
Subject: Paper-6-WV- Re: Number of access
I have to agree with Rosamaria, when she says the web isn't going to go away.
It is a part of the culture and will only expand. If it provides an avenue to
more success for our students then it should be used to its best advantage.
This success might be the result of increased interest because of the medium
used to in the classes but that is irrelevant. The positive effects are
really what are important.
Counting hits and length of time on a page is nice but is not a clear
indicator of effort. The analogy would be to clock time spent by a student
with his/her book open to one page in a text. The reasons for that page being
open can only be inferred.
Walt
Walt Volland
Department of Chemistry
Bellevue Community College
Bellevue, Washington 98007
425-641-2467
wvolland@bcc.ctc.edu
luckybel@aol.com
[ Part 6: "Included Message" ]
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 09:36:09 -0700
From: Scott Donnelly <aw_donnelly@AWC.CC.AZ.US>
Subject: Paper 6: sjd Response to Dr. Sauder's comments...
First, my apologies to Dr. Fong for this email that strays from the
discussion regarding her paper.
Second, Deborah Sauder's previous global comments about the "failure" of
traditional science education are incomplete. I would add in response to
the failures that the successes of traditional science education are also
all around us.
Most of us participating would humbly state that we are just an average
person who worked hard to obtain a professorship, senior research position
in industry, etc. in a chosen discipline we developed a predominate
interest in. Few of us would consider ourselves mega intelligent
wunderkinds. So traditional science education (whatever that means...I'm
still confused by the phrase but I guess it means how we, the non-GenXers,
were taught) did us some good. It likely did others no good for whatever
reason. Imagine that? No surprise there it's not 100% effective.
I never got into Milton, Blake, Wordsworth, and other English literature
giants even though I had a undeveloped interest in them (I took the course
as an elective) and it was quite obvious that the professor had a GREAT
enthusiasm for the English language. Other students enjoyed the Dickens
(pun intended) out of the class. Was I or the others a statistical
aberration? No. Was the professor's style at fault? No, because other
students enjoyed it, learned from it, and thrived on it. Is traditional
science education *completely* useless or a *complete* failure (seemingly
the predominate opinion found in the literature)? No, because it works for
some students. Is inquiry learning the BEST way to teach science? No, but
it works for some students and in some cases may be the best approach to
teaching a particular topic. If all chemical educators were to adopt
inquiry learning would the general public still have difficulty in grasping
or have an interest in knowing how science is involved in policy making?
Yes. I asked a few students if they enjoy science. They do. Are they
thinking about a career in science? No. Why? They have other interests that
grab their attention and excite them more. A lack of student interest in
science comparable to ours or even science/engineering majors does not
necessarily mean that we, chemical educators, failed to reach them.
Remember- we wax eloquent every week, in every J.Chem.Ed issue about
different learning styles among students. Why is it so hard for some
chemical educators to accept that some students (maybe even greater than
50% of the class!) may enjoy and learn from a "standard lecture"?
Furthermore, to infer that the public's lack of understanding science in
policy making or developing an interest in science is predicated to a
*large degree* (my interpretation of Dr. Sauder's comment due to her
enthusiastic response to Dr. Volland's previous comments) on the failure of
traditional science education is a gross oversimplification of a
multivariable topic.
Exodus of qualified people (students?) from science because of the failure
of traditional science education? A casuality? Maybe a correlation but a
*major* cause I doubt it. There is a correlation between foot size and
reading ability among children ages 4-10 (arbitrary minimum and maximum
caps). But does a casuality exist between the two correlated variables? No.
How do I teach? I use a lil' bit of this (inquiry based exercises), a lil'
bit of that (groupwork exercises), and of course I do the dreaded lecture,
i.e. I deliver information, a unilateral discussion of sorts. I don't use
any one particular learning/teaching method predominately any more than I
would bake cookies (yes, I bake) using only flour and expect to get
chocolate chip cookies out of it.
Also, in response the Dr. Sauder's comment that students no longer fall
asleep in Hood College's general chemistry courses, I wish to reply that
students do not fall asleep in my class either (even when I taught general
chemistry at 6:30am one semester!!) and I don't use inquiry based teaching
methodologies predominately. And they probably wouldn't fall asleep either
if I changed to inquiry based methods.
Good and effective teaching is heterogeneous in scope. Sometimes what works
in teaching/learning one topic may not work when teaching/learning another.
We also know that what worked for one topic a year ago in some class did
not work for another set of students in the same class a year later. Just
because the car engine stops running does not mean that there is no gas in
the tank. Filling the tank with gas may not be the answer. Putting in new
spark plugs may be the solution.
The bottom line to this rambling email? In my experience there is no one
best *general* way to teach or for students to learn. As soon as we
understand that a particular teaching method may work somewhere with some
set of students may not work as effectively elsewhere with another set of
students, the sooner we can get around to discussing the more practical
(the engineer in me is coming out) concerns of teaching such as what
demos/labs/exercises etc. are out there that may help show some particular
concept and possibly improve student learning, appreciation, and/or
literacy of science.
Cheers!
Scott D.
Scott Donnelly Email: aw_donnelly@awc.cc.az.us
Department of Chemistry Phone: 520 344 7590
Arizona Western College Webpage: http://www.awc.cc.az.us/chem/
Yuma, AZ 85366-0929
"In education it is not enough to be aware that other
people may try to fool you;it is more important to be
aware of your own tendency to fool yourself."
-Paul G. Hewitt
[ Part 7: "Included Message" ]
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 12:44:47 -0500
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
Subject: Paper 6: RF - How to access the CHEM0010 study guide
Thanks Tom for bringing this to my attention. A demonstration of my study
guide can be accessed via the URL:
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/chemconf98/0010/
You can also access the study guide from the paper. It is about 1/2 way
down the opening page. Also, at the top of all subsequent pages, whenever
you see the red and white water molecule icon, just click on that.
Rosamaria Fong
Tom O'Haver wrote:
>I wonder how many of the ChemConf participants realize that they
>can actually view your entire Study Guide on-line? This
>was not evident to me at first - and in fact I can't seem to
>find the link that got me there in the first place. Perhaps
>you should make the link to the study guide easier to find.
>Or perhaps I have overlooked somethink obvious.
British Columbia Institute of Technology
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
604-412-7438
[ Part 8: "Included Message" ]
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 13:43:39 -0500
From: Bert Ramsay <c3@BIZSERVE.COM>
Subject: Re: Paper-6-WV- Re: Number of access
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Walt Volland says:
> Counting hits and length of time on a page is nice but is not a clear
> indicator of effort. The analogy would be to clock time spent by a
student
> with his/her book open to one page in a text. The reasons for that page
being open can only be inferred.
========== The "Learning Curve Monitor" that is part of my problem solving
software with Personal Tutor does more than that: for each student, it
keeps track of: 1) the number and types of incorrect answers, 2) the amount
and type of help requested from the Personal Tutor, and 3) the time spent
(completed or incomplete) on each problem ( and, of course, the number of
problems worked on.
====== thus it would take care of the common experience when the student
comes into your office and says: "I spent HOURS studying (on the web study
guide?) for this exam! I don't understand why I missed so many questions."
Bert Ramsay, http://www.BizServe.com/c3
[ Part 9: "Included Message" ]
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 13:50:03 -0500
From: Bert Ramsay <c3@BIZSERVE.COM>
Subject: Re: Paper 6 - RF- Number of access
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Rosamaria says:
>> If I can give each student one-on-one time help in their
> >studies, I know they can do better on tests and learn more. I guess
that's why some students retain private tutors. A web-based study guide is
the
> >next best thing to that one-on-one. Does anybody have any similar
> experience?
> >
To which George Long responds:
> This is a wonderful and intriguing statement. The assumption here is
that we put something of ourselves into the webpages, and that in this way,
webpages, with their interactivity, differ from handing out a paper study
guide. The whole problem is just crying out for some good AI. I guess
thats why I'm interested in exactly how the students use the web study
guide, what paths they take through the information, etc. Understanding
this should help to create more efficient study guides.
==== You can add my Personal Tutor to the web study guide as per message
sent a few minutes ago.
Bert Ramsay
[ Part 10: "Included Message" ]
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 14:06:29 -0500
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
Subject: Paper-6 - RF -Sharing of Tools
I have set up two example tools that you can try over the Internet. This two
tools that were developed to achieve user interactivity:
online testing and the display of marks.
1. Online testing is a multiple-choice/numerical input type of test. Upon
submission of the test, students instantly get their scores and a set of
hints that guide them to the correct answer. Students find this gratifying
when they get high scores. When they get low scores, they get alarmed.
Before they have a chance to put the books down, they usually are curious
enough to have another look at where they went wrong. So, it captivates
their attention just a little longer.
2. The display of marks is another tool that students find useful because
they can monitor their progress in the course. It's an up-to-date histogram
display of the individual's marks as well as the class's marks. In a way,
it's a marks manager for me and I don't have to do spreadsheet at the end of
the term.
You can try these two tools in the study guide (URL:
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/chemconf98/0010/).
Start the study guide by clicking on the button "CHEM 0010 study guide" on
the bottom of the opening page. To try the online tests, I've set up some
online assignments for demonstration. Click on the "Access Assignments"
button on the button bar. Submit the assignments online and see the display
of your score for the assignment by clicking on the Marks Distribution icon.
The display of marks is generated on-the-fly. The program that makes this
works calculates the average and display the scores of all submission in a
histogram display.
So ... what does all this have to do with you? If this is in-line with what
you are doing and you like this concept of adding an interactive to your
existing web site, feel free to e-mail me. I'd be delighted to share the use
of these tools with you for free. How to get this to work for you will
require some technical configurations from your end. If you'd like to have
your technical people to contact me, we can work on this together.
Rosamaria Fong
British Columbia Institute of Technology
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
604-412-7438
[ Part 11: "Included Message" ]
Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 20:43:24 -0500
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
Subject: Paper 6 - RF-Re: Number of access
The conference may be interested in these questions/comments that were
directed to me privately.
>I did develop programs (not web based) which provided many problems to work on
>with a multilevel tutor which helps with each problem, and simulations and
>animations as appropriate. I found students who spent 4 or more hours using
>the programs earned about 1.8 to 2.4 grades better on tests. I started using
>some these programs 7 years ago. I'm finding fewer students using the programs
>over time despite the benefits, which have continued for users. I've also
>come to the conclusion that if students spent the additional 4 hours with
>their textbook, or lecture notes, or a study guide they would also do better
>on tests.
I haven't conducted any controlled studies on how much my students improve
when they use the study guide.
Any suggestions as to how it could be set up so that the I can draw unbiased
conclusions from the data?
I dug up my marks folder and these are the class average from each offering.
I've taught this course 5 times. I'd say the enrolment is about 10 students
per offering of the course.
1993 summer 65% (traditional method of teaching)
1994 summer 66% (traditional method of teaching)
1996 winter 73% (traditional method + study guide)
1996 summer 70% (traditional method + study guide)
1997 summer 78% (traditional method + study guide)
The summer of 1997 was the first time that I implemented the weekly online
assignments. I feel that students are benefitting the most from these
online exercises. You're right, if students are willing to spend more time
with textbook, or lecture notes they'd probably do just as well ... but they
don't. My experience is that my students are willing to spend the extra
time when the course is on a screen in front of them. Why? ... I don't know.
>I've found that the stronger students tend to use the material more. They
>liked using the tutorial a few times since in a three step problem it saved a
>lot of the time spent experimenting- check the answer, try again. I've often
>wondered, though they learn how to do a given type of problem more quickly,
>how does this affect their general problem solving ability?
>
>Many other variables exist. I'm looking for the most efficient way a spending
>limited time and resources. Are there particular parts of your study guide
>which appear to be especially effective?
>
Interesting ... I am finding that the stronger students use the study guide
less extensively than the weaker students.
All of the students use the weekly online assignments to gauge their
understanding of the course. With the stronger students, the hints that the
online assignments alone seem to be enough to guide them to the correct
answer. These students tend to use
the study guide prior to tests and the final exam. With the weaker
students, it's an iterative process. They go through the online assignments
and find that they don't fully understand the hints to the questions. They
will go to the pages of the site and/or textbook to do more reading on the
subject and resubmit until they get it.
The online testing and the online display of marks are the most effective
tools. The up-to-date display of marks makes the students more aware of how
he/she is doing in the course. If it were not for the Web access, I sure
don't have the time to do up each student's mark and the class average on a
daily, weekly, or monthly basis.
>
>>My impression with my students is that with the
>>entire course presented to them right from the start, it gives them a sense
>>of comfort and confidence that if they work at it, they will do well ... so
>>they end up working at it more.
>
>Why is this different than handing out a syllabus? Could you explain this a
>bit more?
>
I don't usually hand out a syllabus. I usually give my student a 2-3 page
course outline at the beginning of the term. This is the same course
outline that you can access on the demo site (URL:
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/chemconf98/0010) opening page.
I know that if I give more than 3 pages, they are not interested. With the
presentation on the Web, I can go into details on a subject by making the
pages for that subject deeper and deeper. They don't get to see the "pages"
behind the screen unless they click on the hypertext. When they are ready to
pursue a subject, they actively click to retrieve the information bit by bit
and not all at once.
Rosamaria Fong
British Columbia Institute of Technology
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
604-412-7438
[ Part 2: "Included Message" ]
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 01:38:46 -0500
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
Subject: Paper 6: RF - Textbooks going online
Last week I had an opportunity to talk to a representative from McGraw-Hill.
I was told that their best-selling textbook by Chang has an accompanying
Web-based study guide. I have not seen the study guide. Has anyone heard,
seen or used this study guide?
Rosamaria Fong
British Columbia Institute of Technology
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
604-412-7438
[ Part 3: "Included Message" ]
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 07:41:55 EST
From: Walt Volland <Luckybel@AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: -WV- Paper 6: RF - Textbooks going online
Yes I have, and what they have done is put the paper copy on the web with
interactive multiple choice drill questions.
They are in the midst of putting the package together as they market it. It
is not a completed work right now.
The study guide was much like an electronic book. It kept the scores for the
practice quizzes. It had features like those at BCIT.
It looked interesting but we already have all the same options on our own
system at BCC.
I know there are other packages coming on the market soon. So shop around
before making a commitment.
Walt Volland
Department of Chemistry
Bellevue Community College
Bellevue, Washington 98007
425-641-2467
[ Part 4: "Included Message" ]
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 07:50:33 EST
From: Donald Rosenthal <ROSEN1@CLVM.CLARKSON.EDU>
Subject: Last Day For Discussion of Paper 6
To: CHEMCONF Registrants
From: Donald Rosenthal
ROSEN1@CLVM.CLARKSON.EDU
Re: LAST DAY FOR DISCUSSION OF PAPER 6
It is 8 AM EST (Eastern Standard Time - 1300 GMT) on Thursday, February 26
This is the last day for discussion of Paper 6 -
"Students' Response to the Use of Computer-Mediated Communication (CMC)
for Teaching Chemistry"
by Rosamaria Fong
Consideration of Paper 7 will begin at 8 AM EST tomorrow - Friday, February 27.
[ Part 5: "Included Message" ]
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 08:06:57 -0600
From: Carolyn Judd <cjudd@TENET.EDU>
Subject: 6 - exams
Rosamaria,
I am very impressed with the quality of your web pages for your
students.
Are your major exams also given over the web?
Have you seen or suspected that a problem arises when instruction is in
one medium (the computer) and examinations are in another (paper and
pen)?
Carolyn Judd
Houston Community College
cjudd@tenet.edu
[ Part 6: "Included Message" ]
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 09:17:11 -0500
From: Bert Ramsay <c3@BIZSERVE.COM>
Subject: Re: Paper 6: RF - Textbooks going online
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Rosamaria Fong asks:
> Last week I had an opportunity to talk to a representative from
McGraw-Hill.
> I was told that their best-selling textbook by Chang has an accompanying
> Web-based study guide. I have not seen the study guide. Has anyone
heard,
> seen or used this study guide?
=== I have been talking with WcB/McGraw-Hill for some time about
incorporating CHEMiCALC into their software. Still talking.
I should mention that a number of web-based products have appeared in the
last year. E.g. "The Chemistry Place" from Peregrine Publications comes to
mind.
Bert Ramsay
[ Part 7: "Included Message" ]
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:28:02 -0500
From: Jimmy Reeves <reeves@UNCWIL.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paper 6: RF - Textbooks going online
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Rosemarie et al,
As I understand their approach, McGraw Hill will install "Top Class" on
your server to administer your course on -line. That will provide an
overall structure that permits on-line quizzing, reviewing of study guides
and course notes, grade distribution, and other administrative chores. Each
student has an individual account, with the corresponding user name and
password, and his/her progress is tracked by the software. It's similar to
what you describe and what many of us are working on, and in this case it
will closely parallel the Chang text. I worry about my network
administrator's response to having an outside company install such a system
on our servers, but other than that this model may serve well. As is
typical with most publishers, the intent is to sell more copies of Chang,
not to move the world to the WWW. It may still be true that the most
important decision is what text we are most comfortable with, since in this
model the text is the central, organizing metaphor.
As has been suggested, all publishers are trying to develop Internet
incentives, and it's worth shopping around. You may also want to consider
what the rest of your colleagues at your school are doing. At UNCW, I
suspect we'll adopt a university wide testing and grade distribution system,
either developed in house or purchased through some outside company, so
students in every on-line course we offer will see the same stuff.
Jimmy Reeves
-----Original Message-----
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
To: CHEMCONF@UMDD.UMD.EDU <CHEMCONF@UMDD.UMD.EDU>
Date: Thursday, February 26, 1998 12:39 AM
Subject: Paper 6: RF - Textbooks going online
Last week I had an opportunity to talk to a representative from McGraw-Hill.
I was told that their best-selling textbook by Chang has an accompanying
Web-based study guide. I have not seen the study guide. Has anyone heard,
seen or used this study guide?
Rosamaria Fong
British Columbia Institute of Technology
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
604-412-7438
[ Part 8: "Included Message" ]
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 12:20:33 -0500
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
Subject: Paper 6: RF - RE: JR - Textbooks going online
Jimmy Reeves wrote:
>As I understand their approach, McGraw Hill will install "Top Class" on
>your server to administer your course on -line. That will provide an
>overall structure that permits on-line quizzing, reviewing of study guides
>and course notes, grade distribution, and other administrative chores. Each
>student has an individual account, with the corresponding user name and
>password, and his/her progress is tracked by the software.
My understanding is that they use their own software called MHLA, (McGraw
Hill Learning A__ (something)), something that was developed from
"TopClass", and they've made it proprietary. If one adopts the Chang
textbook, one has the option to buy the software and someone will have to
administer the server on campus. Students will have to spend additional
money to buy the CD-ROM (for ID and password and have local access to the
study guide) to use the study guide.
> I worry about my network
>administrator's response to having an outside company install such a system
>on our servers, but other than that this model may serve well. As is
>typical with most publishers, the intent is to sell more copies of Chang,
>not to move the world to the WWW. It may still be true that the most
>important decision is what text we are most comfortable with, since in this
>model the text is the central, organizing metaphor.
At BCIT, if our School of Business decides to go with McGraw-Hill study
guides with their textbooks, we are thinking of one study guide per server.
This is because our School of Business has a huge enrollment. This could
become a nightmare for the school's network administrator.
As with the Chang study guide, I agree that the intent is to sell more
copies of the textbook. I wonder if McGraw-Hill sat down with any of the
professors in the design stages of the study guide. If the study guide is
open for viewing, please pass on the URL.
Rosamaria Fong
British Columbia Institute of Technology
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
604-412-7438
[ Part 9: "Included Message" ]
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 16:37:03 +0000
From: pankuch <pankuch@MAIL.ECLIPSE.NET>
Subject: Re: CHEMCONF Digest - 24 Feb 1998 to 25 Feb 1998
>From Walt Volland
>This success might be the result of increased interest because of the medium
>used to in the classes but that is irrelevant. The positive effects are
>really what are important.
We have finite resources to help our students with, and they have finite time
to learn with, it is important to find the most efficient new methods,
especially those which are long term effective. Looking at details may help
us identify what aspects are most effective. If they exist. As George says
below "Understanding this should help to create more efficient study guides."
George Long
>The whole problem is just crying out for some good AI. I guess
>thats why I'm interested in exactly how the students use the web study
>guide, what paths they take through the information, etc. Understanding
>this should help to create more efficient study guides.
Sounds a lot like the Artificial Intelligence 'expert system' which has proven
quite successful in a number of specific applications. It would be
interesting if Rosamaria has a sense ofwhat particular parts seem most
effective for the students actually learning chemistry? I can see where
"online testing and the online display of marks are the most effective tools."
would be popular, but how do they help the student learn chemistry?
Rosamaria Fong wrote:
>Any suggestions as to how it could be set up so that the I can draw unbiased
>conclusions from the data?
>I dug up my marks folder and these are the class average from each offering.
>I've taught this course 5 times. I'd say the enrolment is about 10 students
>per offering of the course.
>1993 summer 65% (traditional method of teaching)
>1994 summer 66% (traditional method of teaching)
>1996 winter 73% (traditional method + study guide)
>1996 summer 70% (traditional method + study guide)
>1997 summer 78% (traditional method + study guide)
With small numbers of students, with one section available at a time I don't
see a way to experiment using double blind controls. You could ask a
colleague to look at the tests you've given over the last five years to get
an opinion if you've changed difficulty level. I can see why your students
spend time with your study guide, it is quite interesting exploring the links.
What kind of questions do you ask based on the Bader site?
Brian Pankuch
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Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:12:20 -0500
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
Subject: Paper 6: RF - Study Guide
>It would be
>interesting if Rosamaria has a sense ofwhat particular parts seem most
>effective for the students actually learning chemistry? I can see where
>"online testing and the online display of marks are the most effective tools."
> would be popular, but how do they help the student learn chemistry?
>
An area of on-going research is to determine the degree to which student's
study skills are transferred to other subject areas.
What's important is at that some point the guidance that students get from
using the online study guide will become self-actuating and influence
student study habits in courses where this was not provided.
What is not known at present is which on-line components contributed the
most to student success, or if the same guidance given off-line would have
the same effect. However, if students at a pre-college level are finding
this type of tool helpful, perhaps, the use of similar tools could be
beneficial at the high school level.
Rosamaria Fong
British Columbia Institute of Technology
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
604-412-7438
[ Part 11: "Included Message" ]
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 23:00:05 -0500
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
Subject: Paper 6: RF- Textbooks going online
While we were discussing textbooks going online, this came in on another
discussion listserv that may be of interest to all.
Rosamaria Fong
>Today at Okanagan University College Murray Goldberg gave a talk describing
>his WebCT software for developing Interactive Academic Web Courses. During
>the talk it was revealed that an agreement has been made with Prentice Hall
>publishing company to use WebCT with a significant number of their
>textbooks. Prentice Hall would supply instructors with a WebCT package
>specially designed to complement a text they publish. This package could
>contain online course lecture notes, glossary of terms, online
>conferencing, student email, online note indexing and search capabilities,
>online quizzes, and a host of student management tools. Some of these
>packages will be available this fall.
>
<snip>
>
>Murray also throughout some numbers related to WebCT's use at various
>institutions. UBC has about 300 courses using WebCT in some form. While
>UCLA in California has over 1000 courses online.
>
>Michael
>
>
>
>
>__________________________________
>Dr. Michael Pidwirny
[ Part 2: "Included Message" ]
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 00:05:32 -0500
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@BCIT.BC.CA>
Subject: Paper 6: RF - Final remarks
I want to thank you all for your interest in the web-based study guide that
I've developed for teaching Chemistry. I've enjoyed the discussion
tremendously. Feel free to send me an e-mail if you would like to share
more thoughts on this subject.
Best regards,
Rosamaria Fong
British Columbia Institute of Technology
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
604-412-7438
[ Part 4: "Included Message" ]
Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 10:08:47 -0600
From: sc18 <sc18@TRUMAN.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paper 6: RF- Textbooks going online
I'm intensely interested in WebCT for mobilizing prevenient knowledge in
organic. How can I contact Murray Goldberg?
Sincerely,
Ken Fountain
[ Part 4: "Included Message" ]
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 14:35:38 -0800
From: Terry Ramage <ramage@DOWCO.COM>
Subject: Re: Paper 6: RF - Textbooks going online
I haven't. Rosamaria can you tell someone that students use the guide for a
variety of
reasons. I am a weaker student, poor in math and I can use this study guide to
preview
each unit so that when it is presented in class the understanding and
comprehension
increases exponentially. The study guide is keyed to the course and therefore I
am not
spending a lot of time getting sidetracked reading other interesting but not
relevant
stuff in the text book. Also when you are logged on and are paying for the time
online
you go and get what you want or need and get off, so you are a lot more focused
when you
log on, as oppposed to when you pick up a text book. And there is the argument
for the
youth of today that are very comfortable at a computer and maybe more so that
with a
large intimidating text book open in front of them.
Just some basic thoughts, nothing too ceribal.
Dianne (still having fun)
Rosamaria Fong wrote:
>
> Last week I had an opportunity to talk to a representative from McGraw-Hill.
> I was told that their best-selling textbook by Chang has an accompanying
> Web-based study guide. I have not seen the study guide. Has anyone heard,
> seen or used this study guide?
>
> Rosamaria Fong
> British Columbia Institute of Technology
> http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
> rfong@bcit.bc.ca
> 604-412-7438
[ Part 5: "Included Message" ]
Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 18:34:34 -0600
From: sc18 <sc18@TRUMAN.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paper 6: RF - Textbooks going online
Terry Ramage wrote:
> I haven't. Rosamaria can you tell someone that students use the guide for a
> variety of
> reasons. I am a weaker student, poor in math and I can use this study guide
to
> preview
> each unit so that when it is presented in class the understanding and
> comprehension
> increases exponentially. The study guide is keyed to the course and therefore
I
> am not
> spending a lot of time getting sidetracked reading other interesting but not
> relevant
> stuff in the text book.
Hi All, This is a classical situation about which I've written before. This
student mobilizes his "prevenient knowledge" and then when he sees how the
"master"
deals artfully with the same material, he makes progress in his own
understanding.
We all need to apply ourselves to understanding the Tacit Dimension, written
on
by Polanyi.
[ Part 2: "Included Message" ]
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 1998 07:49:56 EST
From: Donald Rosenthal <ROSEN1@CLVM.CLARKSON.EDU>
Subject: Paper 6 - McGraw Hill Site
In a few minutes we will begin with Short Questions about Paper 8.
I am forwarding this message from Rosamaria Fong relating to some
of the discussion of Paper 6.
Donald Rosenthal
----------------------------Original message----------------------------
From: Rosamaria Fong <rfong@bcit.bc.ca>
Subject: McGraw-Hill site
This came a little late past the discussion for my paper, but here's URL
for the McGraw-Hill site if you want to pass it onto the conference
participants.
http://www.mhla.net/
It's a demo site to view the MHLA (McGraw-Hill Learning Architecture) sample
chapters, and demo on editting
a page, a test, etc ...
Quite interesting
Thanks,
Rosmaria Fong
British Columbia Institute of Technology
http://nobel.scas.bcit.bc.ca/
rfong@bcit.bc.ca
604-412-7438